More on Origins of Q's Y haplogroup's origins of Turkey-Part II on Hittite Possibile Origins
Nadene Goldfoot
Our Jewish line, determined by my brother, of Q happens to be Q-BZ67 with origins originally from Siberia, Mongolia and parts of Turkey. It was first labeled as Q-M242, and Q -Y2200 . His cousin, Ian Goldfoot, was labeled as Q-M378. It's Turkey's ancient history that I'm interested in, as our Jewish line has worked its way to the area of Israel in the days of Moses (1391-1271 BCE) and kings David (1010-970 BCE) and his son, Solomon(961-920 BCE).
Update:5/21/22: Asia:: Q-M242 originated in Asia (Altai regions), and is widely distributed across it. Q-M242 is found in Russia, Siberia (Kets, Selkups, Siberian Yupik people, Nivkhs, Chukchi people, Yukaghirs, Tuvans, Altai people, Koryaks, etc.), Mongolia, China, Uyghurs, Tibet, Korea, Japan, Indonesia, Vietnam, Thailand, India, Pakistan,Afghanistan, Iran, Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan, and so on.
from FTDNA's Q group:
Q-Y2232
This branch is primarily found in the modern Ashkenazi Jewish population. For those with Ashkenazi Jewish oral traditions, our definitive SNP appears to Q-Y2232. Other Jewish Diaspora Q branches seem to come from elsewhere on the Q tree. They likely came into the Jewish population separately from Q-Y2232. Immediately above Q-Y2232 is Q-Y2200. It is unclear right now how and when those who are Q-Y2200 but not Q-Y2232 are related to their Ashkenazi Jewish cousins.
(Since we were first labeled as Q-Y2200, we certainly are Jewish !) You can stop doubting. Q-Y2200 was born about 2,500 years ago either in southern Europe or Middle East. Most men from this line today are Ashkenazi Jews. This is the population of central and eastern European Jews. It is the offshoot of Q-Y2211.
"The Bible connects the Hittites with the Canaanites (Gen.10:15) and indicates that some dwelt in Canaan at an early period. Abraham purchased the cave at Machpelah from a Hittite, and Esau took wives from among them. The Hittites were one of the 7 peoples from whom the Israelites conquered Canaan. Later, David had Hittite warriors, and Solomon, Hittite wives. "
But Uriah, being a disciplined soldier, refused to visit his wife. So David murdered him by proxy by ordering all of Uriah's comrades to abandon him in the midst of battle, so that he ended up getting killed by an opposing army. Following Uriah's death, David took Bathsheba as his eighth wife. Uriah was a Hittite. Was Bathsheba?
Others matching are:Q-L245, Q-BZ31, Q-BZ216, QBZ930, Q-M378, Q-YP1008, Q-YP1231, Q-Y1010, QBZ38, Q-BZ43
Q-M242 is mainly the predominant Y-DNA haplogroup among Native Americans and several peoples of Central Asia and Northern Siberia.
Even in the Paleolithic period, Anatolia (or Asia Minor as it was once called) served as a bridge for migrations between Africa, Asia, and Europe. Long before the establishment of nation states, intermixing between human populations occurred in Anatolia. Indeed, Anatolia has been home to many civilizations including Hattians, Hurrians, Assyrians, Hittites, Greeks, Thracians, Phrygians, Urartians, Armenians, and Turks. Since Assyria had attacked Israel in 721 BCE and carried away the best of the population, and then the Babylonians, who had taken over the Assyrian holdings, had carried away Judeans in 597 and 586 BCE, probably mixing genes at both times, I'm not surprised to find we bear this Y haplogroup. Hittites were from Anatolia and were in Canaan, mixed with the Canaanites as one of the city-states. They fought the Israelites, then were absorbed into the nation, with David and Solomon marrying Hittite women. Our history has made sure that we could be in contact with the QBZ67 Y haplogroup of Anatolia (Asia Minor).
- Could this be that the Hittites had left Anatolia and had migrated to Canaan, leaving only a few of them?
Gene flow between Anatolian, Caucasus, and northern Levantine populations occurred during the Late Neolithic and Chalcolithic to the Early Bronze age, including long-distance migration from Central Asia to Anatolia (1). The Turkic peoples, a collection of ethnolinguistically related populations originating from Central Asia, were first documented in western Eurasia in the fourth/fifth century BCE and currently live in Central, Eastern, Northern, and Western Asia as well as in parts of Europe and in North Africa
Haplogroup Q is found predominantly in Central Siberia, Central Asia and among Native Americans. Approximately 90% of pre-Columbian Native Americans belonged to haplogroup Q, and all descend from the branch Q1a2a1 (L54), including various subclades of Q1a2a1a1 (M3) and Q1a2a1a2 (Z780).
"Haplogroup Q-M242 is one of the two branches of P1-M45 also known as K2b2a (The other is R-M207).
Q-M242 is believed to have arisen around the Altai Mountains area (or South Central Siberia), approximately 17,000 to 31,700 years ago. However, the matter remains unclear due to limited sample sizes and changing definitions of Haplogroup Q: early definitions used a combination of the SNPs M242, P36.2, and MEH2 as defining mutations". Then it had plenty of time to make its way to Israel along the Mediterranean Sea.
In Europe haplogroup Q is found chiefly in southern Sweden (5%), among Ashkenazi Jews (5%). It is found in various isolated pockets in central and Eastern Europe such as the Rhône-Alpes region of France, southern Sicily, southern Croatia, northern Serbia, parts of Poland and Ukraine, which should be the Jewish group, Šarić et al. (2013) also found 6.1% of haplogroup Q out of 412 samples from the island of Hvar in southern Croatia (accompanied by 2% of East Asian mtDNA haplogroup F).
Q-L275 is the branch originated by the first bifurcation (before 26 kya; between 27.8 and 32.5 kya according to Poznik et al. [29]) of haplogroup Q. It comprises Q-Y1150 and Q-M378. The first is mainly observed in Southwest Asia with some appearances in Northwest Eurasia, while the second, recently dissected [30], is spread across West, Central and parts of South Asia and harbours mainly Middle Eastern Y chromosomes, with one branch typical of Ashkenazi Jews, as well as European samples (Additional file 9: Figure S3a,b).
Based on this distribution, the two M378 Y chromosomes observed in the Isthmo-Colombian area (Additional file 9: Figure S3b) should be interpreted as the result of a post-Columbian arrival from Eurasia, as previously hypothesized [20].
Analysis of 89 biallelic polymorphisms in 523 Turkish Y chromosomes revealed 52 distinct haplotypes with considerable haplogroup substructure, ..... The major components (haplogroups E3b, G, J, I, L, N, K2, and R1; 94.1%) are shared with European and neighboring Near Eastern populations and contrast with only a minor share of haplogroups related to Central Asian (C, Q and O; 3.4%), Indian (H, R2; 1.5%) and African (A, E3*, E3a; 1%) affinity. This comprehensive characterization of Y-chromosome heritage addresses many multifaceted aspects of Anatolian prehistory, including: (1) the most frequent haplogroup, J, splits into two sub-clades, one of which (J2) shows decreasing variances with increasing latitude, compatible with a northward expansion;
As it stands today, this is what most people think, from Quora: "The only honest and correct answer is: nobody knows. Only a handful of Anatolian DNA samples from the Middle & Late Bronze Age have been sequenced and analyzed, and they’re so few and so generically “Anatolian” that we can’t be sure they are representative of the Hittites (and not just native Anatolians probably under Hittite rule).
The Hittites were originally an invading population that conquered a very numerous non-Hittite and, in fact, non-Indo-European population. So, even if they absorbed many of the conquered people to their ethnocultural identity, we should consider that it is likely that the first Hittites were genetically very different from the late Hittites who lived well after they had become the elite of a very large and multiethnic state.
So, it might be useful to ask what haplogroups the remote ancestors of the Hittites had in 4000 B.C., what haplogroups the early Hittites had in 2000 B.C., what haplogroups the Hittites had during the Bronze Age collapse. Changes certainly happened. Notice this is a plural noun, because it’s very implausible that the Hittites only had one Y-DNA haplogroup, especially in their apogee as the masters of a large empire. Even tribal and clannish ethnicities of the past usually had several Y-DNA lineages in their midst, though one of them might prevail significantly over the others, mostly on a regional basis, given strong patterns of patrilocality in those societies."
I remember hearing that the Mormons connected the Native Americans to us Jews. They do have something in their Book of Mormon about 2 peoples coming from the same area of Israel. "Since the late 1990s pioneering work of Luigi Luca Cavalli-Sforza and others, scientists have developed techniques that attempt to use genetic markers to indicate the ethnic background and history of individual people. The data developed by these mainstream scientists tell us that the Native Americans have very distinctive DNA markers, and that some of them are most similar, among old world populations, to the DNA of people anciently associated with the Altay Mountains area of central Asia. These evidences from a genetic perspective agree with a large body of archaeological, anthropological, and linguistic conclusions that Native American peoples' ancestors migrated from Asia at the latest 16,500–13,000 years ago. (See Settlement of the Americas and Genetic history of indigenous peoples of the Americas)."
Update: 5/20/22
Resource;
The New Standard Jewish Encyclopedia
https://www.familytreedna.com/groups/jewish-q/about/results
https://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplogroup_Q_Y-DNA.shtml
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8433500/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup_Q-M242
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/14586639/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic_studies_on_Turkish_people
https://www.quora.com/What-was-the-haplogroup-of-the-Hittites
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetics_and_the_Book_of_Mormon
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